Constitution Bill 2009

[Gottingen]

DECLINE

[JasonMckerra]

Decline.

[JasonMckerra]

The measure is decided in the negative.

[JasonMckerra]

We shall now consider the second of Mr Klaas's amendments:

2. The Assembly shall consist of all citizens, barring those who have been suspended as a result of a criminal action.  Decisions shall be made according to a majority vote of those who choose to exercise their rights as legislators.

I move that this amendment be put to a vote.

If there are no objections to this motion in the next 24 hours, we shall begin voting on Mr Klaas's first amendment.

[Zachary Klaas]

Not surprisingly, I vote to APPROVE.

[JasonMckerra]

It's a much better wording.

APPROVE.

[Zachary Klaas]

I had posted something saying that I misunderstood what we were voting on, but I can now see the difficulty was mine, not the forum's.  I do understand what we're voting on now (the second of my amendments) and I do still approve.

[JasonMckerra]

The motion is carried, 2 in favour and 0 against.

[JasonMckerra]

We shall now consider Mr Klaas's third amendment:

4. The Consul shall lead the Government, which shall consist of the Consul and such persons that the Consul might appoint to subordinate executive roles, including the First Minister, subject to the approval of the assembly.

Debate is open for three days, followed by two days to vote.

[JasonMckerra]

Mr Klaas,

I fully support your capitalization of the word "Government", to make clear that the Consul leads the executive arm of the state, which is separate from the legislative and judicial arms.

However, is it necessary to include "including the first minister"? It implies there should be a head of government as well as a head of state. Due to the small size of our Republic, I would propose that we would be best off rolling the two positions into one, in the person of the Consul.

Your thoughts?

[Zachary Klaas]

I introduced the language "including the First Minister" in this section because you mention First Ministers in the section on the Moderative Function.  I thought we needed to include the term here because you don't mention the First Minister anywhere else in the Constitution, so it's not clear where this position comes from.

I know in parliamentary democracies the First Minister/Prime Minister is often not mentioned in a written constitution at all.  That's the case in Canada, for example, where the post of Prime Minister has existed as long as the constitution has, but the office is nevertheless not mentioned in the constitution.  Perhaps it's the same in Australia?

But that's not the case here because you do mention the office later on in this document...so we need to define it, if the position is to exist.  If it's your intention not to have a "First Minister" office, then I would suggest deleting any reference to the position later on.

My preference would be, however, to leave the Consul the prerogative to appoint, or not to appoint, such a person.  So perhaps I would accept as a friendly amendment to change the passage to read "including any First Minister", to suggest that the office may be created by the Consul, and if it were, it's understood that this position would be a Government (with a capital G) position.

[JasonMckerra]

I know in parliamentary democracies the First Minister/Prime Minister is often not mentioned in a written constitution at all.  That's the case in Canada, for example, where the post of Prime Minister has existed as long as the constitution has, but the office is nevertheless not mentioned in the constitution.  Perhaps it's the same in Australia?

It is the same in Australia. I originally wrote in a First Minister (to replace the Consul), but I later decided to leave it unwritten.

It seems I forgot to replace "First Minister" with Consul in the Moderative section, it was my intention that the Council of Elders would be an oversight committee consisting of up to five of the previous heads of state.

Once we are finished considering the current amendments I will introduce an amendment to correct the Moderative function, so that it refers to past Consuls.

If you will accept it as friendly, can we remove the words "including the First Minister," from your amendment?

[Zachary Klaas]

I do accept the friendly amendment.  Proceed as if the words "including the First Minister" were not part of my proposed amendment.

[JasonMckerra]

If there are no objections in the next twenty four hours, I will call Mr Klaas's third amendment to a vote.

As always, APPROVE to adopt the measure, DECLINE to reject it.

[Zachary Klaas]

APPROVE, in the form as we've discussed above.